Michael Richards (Kramer from Seinfeld) and his racial rant

[Aristotle]

Originally posted by Savaric
I'm supposed to be upset when somebody calls you the n-word, but you call yourselves that all day long? I'm afraid it doesn't work that way.

It's a known fact of life that if you don't respect yourself then no one else will either.

Interesting perspective. Let me make sure I understand you right:

Out of respect and consideration for black people, you wouldn't use the n-word. But as a result of their own (sometimes frequent) use of the word, you aren't going to get offended when someone else uses it - no matter what their race.

If that is what you are saying, then I think you make a very compelling point. I had never thought about it in that way.

[Dalaena]

Originally posted by Jolen
I think there is a double standard in America where, whenever an Anglo says something prejudiced/racist, there is an uproar by both angry ethnics and guilty Anglos. However, when an ethnic person says something similar, there is a collective nod from fellow ethnics and nervous laughter from the Anglo community. Really, picture any Black/Hispanic comedian doing a routine that shows the differences between blacks/hispanics and whites. Now picture an Anglo, doing the inverse of this act. Now which one is going to get the laughs and which one is going to get the jeers?

Personally, I laugh at prejudice/racism directed at me since it usually stems from ignorance and fear than any sort of fact. Perhaps people need to lighten up a bit more in America. Just my two cents..

Thank you, Jolen! I feel almost the exact same way. White guilt is one of the most destructive things to all races, in my opinion. It makes them apologists for behavior that shouldn't come from a human being no matter what the race. No one should get an okay for being publically racist. The reason I say "publically" is because I'm totally against thought crimes. You shouldn't be punished for THINKING something.

I joke all the time with Asian friends about many of our stereotypes. And, guess what? TONS of the Asian stereotypes are totally true. Lots of us eat rice three meals a day. Tons of us do happen to excel at school because our parents destroy us if we don't. A crapload of us do happen to like things like Hello Kitty, Pokemon, and other little cutesy things you see all over Asia. I tend to expect that other Asians that I meet can connect with me on a lot of these cultural things. Does that make me racist? I'd like to think not.

[Jolen]

Stereotypes are there because often times, they are true for a majority of the group being stereotyped. Are they all bad? No. They only become bad when you try to demean another group with them. Often times, when one digs into the roots of a stereotype, you find out all sorts of interesting things about a people's history and/or culture.

[Pyrosama]

Originally posted by Dalaena
Lots of us eat rice three meals a day.

Yep, just about every meal...rice.

Originally posted by Dalaena

Tons of us do happen to excel at school because our parents destroy us if we don't.

If we do not destroy ourselves first...due to the shame of academic failure.

Originally posted by Dalaena

A crapload of us do happen to like things like Hello Kitty, Pokemon, and other little cutesy things you see all over Asia.

Okay, this is where I draw the line.

I think cultural stereotypes are fine, embrace them always. It's the negative stereotypes that are destructive, such that you perpetuate the notion that one race is weaker than or inferior to another by way of grouping them to a particular behavior of a few.

What struck me most about the tirade was not the racial name calling, it was more the comments about "the man" and the whole thing about oppression. In my world there's not a whole lot of exposure to minorities who actually feel that they are victims of a largely anglo populated society.

For the most part minorities in my world excel and have alot of pride in their contributions to society, so his whole rant was meaningless to me. Just babble, but sad.

My daughter asked me two years ago what the word "nigger" meant because she heard it at school, she didn't say "the n word" and she didn't feel any embarassment over asking at all. I told her that when I was in school to call a black person that would be the same thing as another person calling her a "jap", "nip" or "chink" and she goes, "what's a jap, nip or chink?"

Times sure have changed since I was in school.

[Lebeau]

Pyro, I think you illustrated the point quite well. The fact that your daughter had never heard the Asian slurs tells it that there is little to no such hatred in children that young, so why did she hear the "n-word"? Because it was probably thrown around between black kids as a term of endearment.

BTW, I think that show of innocence is too cute even if it does involve nasty words. I'm glad at least you were able to introduce her to those words before someone else did so in hatred.

I asked a couple of my friends in my unit why it's acceptable for black people to use that word, but no one else. Most of them saw my point of view that no one should use it, though they still do. One of them who is quite the racist stated that it was "their word and no one else can use it". Huh? This is the mentality of the ignorant, the ones who foster the use of this derogatory term. The excuses I read on the second link on this thread are pathetic. "Black people have used this word to lessen the hatred and pain it causes." What a load of crap. It's closer to say that those of power and affluence encourage its use in order to impose financial slavery upon their own people. I wish I had a link to a message I read on this (which was taped to a black man's wall) because it brings up many interesting points.

My approach and belief on this partuclar word comes from my old ROTC instructor in high school. He is a black man, but more importantly, he is a gentleman and a damn fine NCO. He heard a couple of black cadets call each other that. Whether it was in play or out of respect, I don't remember. But he exploded and informed them that it was improper for ANYONE to say it. And that has been my stance ever since.

So count me in Jolen and Savaric's camp. If a man wants to be so ignorant as to impose his own racial slur upon himself and then get offended when someone not of like ethnicity uses it on him, I have no fucking sympathy. He's an ignorant prick, plain and simple. Personally, I love the terms cracker, honky, and whitey. So what? I'm white! Anyone with working eyes can see that. If you call me a cracker, I'll ask if I'm a Ritz or just a lowly saltine! That shit don't offend me.

All that said, the fact that Richards said this is a show of a lack of class. The very same lack of class his hecklers had when they called him a "cracka muthafucka". It's two-faced for them to try to take the high road and get offended and then turn around and do the same thing themselves. All three participants are classless jackasses as far as I'm concerned.

[Leshrak]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...q=kramer&hl=en


There's a video of Matt Lauer interviewing the two racist assholes that were taunting Kramer on stage.

[Metiao]

Nobody would have their panties in a bunch if it was a black man throwing that word around.

I think that's all I need to say in order to post my thoughts.

[Darion]

White apologism for the lose.

[Malacasta]

Originally posted by Darion
White apologism for the lose.

What does that mean?

[Gaviani]

"White apologism": the tendency of whites, hypersensitive about any and all matters of race, to instinctively assume that whites are inherently disallowed from taking a negative stand on racial issues towards anyone of any minority group; the excessively permissive attitudes of "guilty whites" towards minorities in racial matters arising from an ideology centering around the notion that, regardless of the ills that plague any minority community, whites probably started it. See also: "white guilt."

"For the lose": a term indicating the subject of which (in this case, "white apologism") is bad, undesirable, or, in perhaps more familiar terms, "doubleplusungood"; the opposite of "for the win." See also: "ftl," "ftw."

There you go.