Printable View
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...102701042.html
Yeah. Big fucking surprise. /sarcasmQuote:
To put Exxon's performance into perspective, its third quarter revenue was greater than the annual gross domestic product of some of the largest oil producing nations, including the United Arab Emirates and Kuwait.
You could put what I know about the ins and outs of the oil business in a thimble and have room left over to get drunk on light beer, but it just seems to me that to take an industry which has just been wholloped by several natural disasters and get upset that their product is now going up in price is sort of odd. The profits are rolling in now because the expenses coming up for all the repairs needed have not come due yet.....
I know enough ex oil men from the 70's and 80's to feel strongly that everyone getting bent out of shape about the oil industry could well be a very, very unhealthy way to go about the process of energy policy reform.
If you want to get mad and get even, use less oil and gas products. I am not trying to be snide, and yes I know that they are very much a necessity, but using less is what is going to drive the market in a healthy way, vs. getting angry and eventually getting the government to do something that may well be Carter-esque in its unintendedconsequentiality.
Neat word eh?
:cow
Did you even read the rest of the article?
Quote:
Exxon said the hurricanes slashed U.S. production volumes by 5 percent from a year ago, while global daily production slipped to 2.45 million barrels of oil equivalent from 2.51 million barrels. By the end of the year, it will cost the company about $100 million after taxes, the company estimated.
Sorry, but I don't take lightly to obvious price gouging. The companies are saying they're losing about $500 million because of the hurricanes, damage AND lost production, and yet they post BILLIONS in -increases- from last year's numbers.Quote:
Shell said hurricane damage would cost it about $350 million, although much of the expense would be covered by insurance.
Quote:
Exxon's net income ballooned 75 percent to $9.92 billion, compared with $5.68 billion a year ago.
Quote:
Shells profits from exploration and production increased by $2.6 billion to $5 billion in spite of an 11 percent decline in oil and natural-gas output. Its refining and marketing profit climbed by $201 million to $1.7 billion.
I have to admit I didn't read the article at all, but I am not surprised by anything you noted in it. I hear it all the time. Nor am I some sort of big business hands-off government type of person.
I'm just saying, obvious price gouging? Again, the remedy is use less fuel. It's not "price gouging" if everyone just pays it. No one was comiserating when the whole industry collapsed, so if they have a good year this year, so what? That is after all what businesses are for.
Now if in the process of all this most of the profits dissapear into the pockets of the top brass plus some sort of payout to the shareholders that is outrageous, well then maybe you have a point, but profits rolled back into the business are part of how we expand production so that the next time there is a hurricane or three we are not taken by surprise. They might for example build inland storage and concieve of some way of making sure most gas stations have back up power so that they can pump gas even when the power goes out, plus a replenishment plan.
It takes money to get things done. Over-reacting might hamstring the industry at a time when it needs to be doing a little upgrading.
All I am saying is don't over-react.
Exxon should buy a new freighter
the Exxon Vasoline
so it don't hurt so much when they stick it to us!
should have titled that artical
" Exxon/Mobile Sticks it to customers, stockholders and officers richer"
no ,it bothers me to no end that they play the victim but in the long run profit from other folks misery. I dont see them sending
any of those billions to new orleans
and say here we made more than we thought.
sell cheap reserves at outrageous prices and yes they will make
a profit, but why did they sell it higher it didnt cost them any more ,nor will replenishing the reserves.
But I guess that shows that the "trickle down effect" doesnt work
the rich get richer and the gap between the haves and the have nots wider.
Exxon-Mobil Employees Given Fake Flu Shots
can't they afford the real thing??http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051028/...fake_flu_shots
When you say the rich get richer, you're confusing the issue. The oil companies are corporations, basically anyone who lives in a first world country has the means available to them to purchase part of these companies. You could have shared in their good fortune had you had the foresight to invest in an oil company two or so years ago.
If you currently think oil prices are too high, you should be probably be blaming those who have and continue to restrict oil exploration in places such as ANWR and coastal areas, along with those who write the regulations making it nearly impossible to build a refinery in the US. If the US had a refining surplus, do you think these companies would be posting record profits? No, their margins would be thinner because they would be competing with other refineries who had capital tied up in refineries not being used.
This is the type of thing I might have said if I knew wtf I was talking about....Quote:
Originally posted by Blog
If you currently think oil prices are too high, you should be probably be blaming ... those who write the regulations making it nearly impossible to build a refinery in the US. If the US had a refining surplus, do you think these companies would be posting record profits?
I'm not all the hot on ANWR, but I noticed most the people who actually LIVE in Alaska are a lot more in favor of it than people here in the lower 48.
The reason gas prices are so high is because we have not built a new refinery in the US since the late 70's, early 80's. Thus forcing us to be more dependant on imported a big percentange of our gas.
I believe the reason oil prices are so high is because oil companies and producers implement a false since of scarcity of product. But I think they will drop back down again once the mainstream press starts reporting on all the new research on how oil is probably Abiotic(?), meaning the earth actually produces its. But we shall see.
Heh... I have NEVER heard of that before. That is interesting stuff. Looked on Wikipedia.Quote:
Originally posted by Klisk
The reason gas prices are so high is because we have not built a new refinery in the US since the late 70's, early 80's. Thus forcing us to be more dependant on imported a big percentange of our gas.
I believe the reason oil prices are so high is because oil companies and producers implement a false since of scarcity of product. But I think they will drop back down again once the mainstream press starts reporting on all the new research on how oil is probably Abiotic(?), meaning the earth actually produces its. But we shall see.
I actually think, regarding the first part of your post, the rise in prices was spurred by the shock shortages in the Katrina hit areas. I know when I was stuck in Hattisburgh I would have gleefully paid $5.00 a gallon just to get the heck out of there. At that point, it is an issue of just plain old fashioned supply and demand. The stuff is just not there, and you need it bad. And I would add, when I finally found a place that had gas, they were charging what they had charged when the power went out. No gouging at all.
It went up slowly over the course of the next few weeks (slowly being a relative term I suppose), then levelled out and dropped. Again, the prices I personally saw were slightly LOWER on average in Missisipi where the damage was most widespread. The shortage was real though for the same reason there was a shortage in Houston for example when everyone left at once. That local shortage has ripple effects. This, again, simply has the effect of raising prices.
Hotels did it. BELEIVE me they did it! $59 rooms became $79+ rooms overnight! People running for their lives from the hurricanes needed places to stay... Does anyone give a *%#$ about that...? For some reason, no. No it is mostly all about oil being, in the minds of a lot of people, just intrinsically evil. It is associated with the Middle East and all that political and religious turmoil, and then to add insult to injury, there is the polution factor and the whole global warming thing, which I am still one of the last holdouts that thinks "how the hell do they talk about times when it has been both warmer AND colder than it is right now, then suddenly just KNOW that global warming is about burning things?" But still... The thing is, oil industry people are just people, and it is just a business. There are programs in place for people who can't heat their homes and things. There is public transportation and stuff for people who have a hard time with the gas, which by the way is still not all THAT expensive among the things I buy anyhow. It's not an industry that just inately attracts the demonically possessed. I just don't get the uproar.
There were some places I am sure that literally gouged, but it can't just be a situation where no one is ever allowed to raise or lower a price until they check with the government to make sure they are allowed to make a lot of profit or not.
Heh, Exxon was the victim there. The flu shots were fake because the medical folks were commiting fraud, or else whoever sold them the shots were.Quote:
Originally posted by xaxer
Exxon should buy a new freighter
the Exxon Vasoline
so it don't hurt so much when they stick it to us!
should have titled that artical
" Exxon/Mobile Sticks it to customers, stockholders and officers richer"
no ,it bothers me to no end that they play the victim but in the long run profit from other folks misery. I dont see them sending
any of those billions to new orleans
and say here we made more than we thought.
sell cheap reserves at outrageous prices and yes they will make
a profit, but why did they sell it higher it didnt cost them any more ,nor will replenishing the reserves.
But I guess that shows that the "trickle down effect" doesnt work
the rich get richer and the gap between the haves and the have nots wider.
Exxon-Mobil Employees Given Fake Flu Shots
can't they afford the real thing??http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051028/...fake_flu_shots
I am not a fan of trickle down economics, but at the same time I am not comfortable with this growing demonization of the oil industry. Any two bit nitwit that wants to can go out right now and get solar panels and wind powered generators. Apparently gas is still pretty cheap and easy compared to anything else anyone can wrap four or five fingers around.
A lot of good points have been raised here, but one of the biggest problems is that Exxon and Mobil should never have been allowed to merge.
They were part of Standard Oil which was broken up in the early 1900s in order to combat over-concentration of oil power. This was the beginning of modern anti-trust law.
The fact that they were allowed to merge was pure idiocy.
Amen
I just realized that Lokrian absolutely agreeing with something Ari said is just amazing.Quote:
Originally posted by Lokrian
Amen
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051109/...o/congress_oil
sorry personally dont buy it
ANWR is a bandaid on a compund fracture. I've seen the stats and what they would expect to get from it versus what the u.s. consumes in oil per year, it's barely supplemental.
If you reverse your logic then I would never use the fancy new lightbulbs or buy the energy efficient appliances, because in the overall scheme of things, they help very little.
Anyway, gas prices are down to just a bit above what they were, and winter is in full swing. We'll put this on hold for a couple years.